TTI Forums

I am reading about the youth riots in France. Apparently the riots are related to a new law that allows a business to fire young workers within two years of their employment date. There are several reasons in my mind that the law is grotesque. First it is based upon age yet unrelated to physiology. Other age-based laws focus upon physical and/or mental capacity as basis for the regulation ie: social pension for diminished capacity to work, or age limitations to operate a car.

From Associated Press
“In Marseille, extreme leftist youths climbed the facade of City Hall, replacing a French flag with a banner reading "Anticapitalism."

Obviously these young rioters put some forethought into their actions, in making a banner and figuring out how to display it. To me the most misguided aspect of this situation occurred long before the new law. When did it become against the law to fire any employee? A free market is at the very heart of capitalism, and yet these protesters view market constraint as a good thing.

Am I confused on this issue ???

An interesting topic, Masashi. Now, I'm not sure how it works in France, but in the United States, there are definate penalties for dismissing an employee without just cause (ie, employee misconduct). So, in that respect, I guess you could call it illegal (the increase in unemployment insurance premiums the employer has to pay when he fires someone without cause could be called a fine).

Now, as far as young employees are concerned. I can only speak from my personal observations, and have no statistics to back me up, but it seems to me that an employer takes the most risk when hiring people aged 18 to say 25 or 26. This age group is perhaps the most unstable in the age spectrum, as they are breaking out on their own for the first time. Turnover is very high (unemployment insurance), their accident rate is high (workman's compensation, another area employers pay insurance premiums based upon their claim history), and they have limited work (and life) experience for a prospective employer to evaluate. From what I understand, many employers in France are reluctant to hire from this group. The laws intent is to encourage more employment of youth to try to reduce their extremely high unemployment rate.

Of course, any regulation imposed on business by government restricts capitalism, although I'm not sure this is always a bad thing. One can look back at the abuses of the industrial revolution and understand why government thought it necessary to step in. Child labor laws, workplace safety, the "standard work week" & overtime, and others were initiated to stop the outright exploitation of workers. Quite often, these reforms were only brought about through pressure from trade unions, which were first formed to give workers some protection. Many of the US's current enviornmental laws were developed to stop business practices which were seen as harming the general public.

An objectivist, of course, would never exploit workers, as in the long run such practices tend to be counterproductive. To bad so many of our business leaders are not true to this vision but instead, are just greedy.

zapitino wrote:An interesting topic, Masashi. Now, I'm not sure how it works in France, but in the United States, there are definite penalties for dismissing an employee without just cause (ie, employee misconduct).

This is certainly true in some states within the US but the majority of US states are employment “at will”. At will employment allows either the worker or the employer to terminate employment without cause. Of course there are provisions for wrongful termination: if the termination related to a violation of the employees rights or a public trust violation of the employer.
Interesting aside if an employee commits a public trust violation, it is the employer that is held liable.

zapitino wrote:Now, as far as young employees are concerned. I can only speak from my personal observations, and have no statistics to back me up, but it seems to me that an employer takes the most risk when hiring people aged 18 to say 25 or 26.

Agreed young employees are less desirable and typically compensated less. The free market can take care of this issue if Governments cease interference.

zapitino wrote:Many of the US's current environmental laws were developed to stop business practices which were seen as harming the general public.

This is the best argument for Government regulation, alack environmental protection does not relate to job protection.

capitalism works on two principles.... well with regards to this example i shall say:

greed and fear. to put it mildly perhaps, production and desire for personal security and place in society.

job protection essentially is locking the worker in their job... if they dont do anything illegal and mostly do the job then they cannot lose thier job under normal circumstances.

if the company has no positive monetary benefits then the worker also has no option to increase his or her wealth. things like bonuses for extra effort, or particularly shining work....

what sort of a worker is molded in this static envirnment? stale and lifeless.... i'm not drawing a direct law here by saying that workers who have nothing to fear will become lazy.... but i will say that workers who have nothing to fear will tend towards laziness. or in the very least, that the temptation will exist.

job protection in limited forms is good for situations where the employer breaks contract etc..... (if the employee really wants job security why not demand a year or 5 year contract etc? nasa for example works that way with its contract jobs.)

but, in general a government mandated job protection law scheme would seem to be a bad thing.



and musashi where is that salt lick bbq place you spoke to me oh so long ago? its been a long time eh.... i think i sent you a pm somewhat recently but never got a response....

Good to see you are still lurking around DT. Hey I just figured out that the Ayn Rand Institute you spoke about is only 100 mi from my house! Too far for me to take regular classes, but I could easily hit some of their events.

As far as Salt Lick goes, http://www.saltlickbbq.com Look at dem hot links jus hangin in space ! So good they float AWAY ! Just make note you gotta BYOB because its a dry county - cursed blue laws.

It is right down the road from your house and a I guarantee you will not be disappointed. Ye Ha !

mmm well i havent drunk in about 3 years since the last irrationality i last had

well i should be over near there for the highlander festival in san antonio in a weekend or two i think.....

ARI has online classes i think.....



heh, you have no idea how good it is to see my sig again with "no games played" and a total listed in the thousands on eve. have started playing a flute heh.... ooo ill start a deep thoughts topic right now.